> From: John Martin <jmartin@netapp.com>
> ...
> I don't think I'm mistaken - perhaps I wasn't clear. What I mean is that
> ISPs do this for their own customers only. Isn't that what you are saying
> AOL does?
I don't think it makes sense to say that hosts of customers of an ISP
are under the administrative control of the ISP. That idea would have
the hosts of some outfits under the administrative control of their
direct competitors.
> >In both cases the ISP must be viewed as a third party, and in
> >security terms, a man in the middle.
>
> OK. That is the confusion. I was viewing the ISP as being in the same
> administrative domain, at least that is true for most dialup ISPs. In this
> case, the customer has a choice to change ISP if they don't like their
> policies.
Thank you very much, but that I use ISDN does not put my computers in
anyone else's administrative domain. And neither would the use of DSL,
cable modems, ATM or FR PVC's or SVC's, or old fashioned leased lines.
What does customer choice have to do with anything? As much as I'm shocked
and horrified by third party redirection proxies, I don't like the idea
of government rules on them. The topic at hand concerns the technical
problems of redirection proxies, perhaps especially redirection proxies
in administrative domains that differ from the domains of both the client
and the server.
> ...
> I suspect that those techniques will ultimately lead to a deprecation in
> the use of interception proxies at source (for web traffic). But that is a
> few years away and we still have the problem of 100 or so Akamai-like
> companies - how does the user determine the closest / best proxy?
Why not the same way the the best ISP is determined?
Note also that there "closest/best proxy" is not a simple metric. Is it
fastest, most accurate, least likely to drop TCP connections, or best ad
filtering?
And never mind about the many ways to define "best ad filtering."
What is best by any of those metrics for the person running an HTTP client
is often not best for the people running the HTTP server. The many parties
running the wires in between have their own, differing ways to determine
"closest/best"
> I still believe the key is in proxy discovery. Or rather, replica discovery
> - since the content will be controlled by the content provider, even if is
> distributed by a third party. This will lead to a brokerage system similar
> to the peering and transit relationships we have already between ISPs...
> but what is still missing is how the user gets told where to look. DNS is
> one answer but may not be the best. E.g. I may not want the fastest /
> closest but rather the cheapest.
Maybe so, although for both technical and non-technical reasons, I
have doubts. but never mind.
> This is what I hope we can start to work on in WREC. But first, we need to
> get our current documents rock solid, get some wider review (particularly
> of the known problems) and get them published and discussed widely.
yes.
Vernon Schryver vjs@rhyolite.com
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : Thu Nov 18 2004 - 11:21:28 MST